♪♪ Kevin: On "Ask This Old House," our experts travel across the country to answer questions about your house.

♪♪ Today, Mark repairs a patio that has settled over time.

Then Nathan talks about types of ladders and accessories that can make some tall tasks easier.

And Keith helps a homeowner install an EV charger.

♪♪ Coming up next on "Ask This Old House."

-Mark: Emmanuel.

-Emmanuel: Hi, Mark.

-Mark: How are you doing?

-Emmanuel: Good.

How are you?

Mark: I'm doing great.

I love the raised beds.

Emmanuel: Thank you.

Mark: Nothing like fresh vegetables.

Emmanuel: I know, we love some squash and tomatoes.

Mark: Great, great.

Emmanuel: But that is not why we called you here.

Mark: Okay?

I had a feeling.

Emmanuel: Yeah.

Can we take out the patio?

-Mark: Let's take a look.

-Emmanuel: Please.

Please.

Yes.

Here it is.

-Mark: Okay.

Emmanuel: Yeah, it's a little pandemic project.

Mark: Sure.

Yeah.

Emmanuel: We had a little extra time on our hands.

We love having friends and family over.

You can see it needs a little bit of love.

Mark: Okay.

So all good.

I think there's a couple obvious things that I see right off the bat.

But why don't we pull a paver?

Emmanuel: Yeah.

Mark: And really get into what we got up against us.

Emmanuel: Okay.

So, actually, when we put it in, we did, like a layer of gravel, and then we did a layer of sand.

Mark: Okay.

Emmanuel: And then we compacted it and put down the pavers.

Mark: Okay.

Well, great.

The first thing that I see when I kind of dig through that is I can see the sand, which is great, but I can also see dirt.

-Emmanuel: Yeah.

Mark: But if I look behind me, I can see where that's coming from.

So that's definitely an area that we're going to fix.

I think the real culprit here is that the walkway is pitched incorrectly, which is causing the water to get under and behind the pavers and move them around.

I think what we should do first is really peel up all these pavers.

We'll recompact everything.

I am going to remove this sand bed.

We'll replace that with clean sand.

Emmanuel: Okay.

Mark: And then I think we'll use gravity as our friend.

You can see down this way, you can see it dips down.

Emmanuel: Yep.

Mm-hmm.

Mark: That's a little path for our water.

This area is real high.

So we're just going to take this patio up a couple inches, and then I think just push everything to the middle and out that way.

And that way, you can avoid this in the future.

Emmanuel: Yes.

Great.

This feels like a lot of work, but I -- my husband's coming, so... -Mark: All right.

Well, I think we can use the hands.

-Emmanuel: Yes, I agree.

-Mark: Let's get going.

-Emmanuel: Okay.

-Mark: All right.

Now that Shannon's here... -Emmanuel: My guy.

Mark: Let's get going.

First thing we want to do is we want to peel up these pavers.

And by the way, I've already taken a picture of the pattern.

So that way we can duplicate the pattern.

So the thing we want to do first, again, is take the 12-by-12s and we'll stack those over there.

We'll stack these smaller ones, the eight-inch over there and the six-inch over there.

That way, when we're going to rebuild, everything will be right behind us and ready to go back in the patio.

Shannon: Gotcha.

Mark: So now that the pavers are gone, what we're going to want to do is take the sand out.

The gravel bed actually feels pretty good under the sand, so a C-plus so far, Emmanuel.

I mean, the grade's going up as we go.

Emmanuel: Okay.

I'll take it.

♪♪ Mark: All right.

So, now that we got all the sand out, remember, we wanted to raise the patio a bit.

So we're going to bring in more gravel.

We're going to spread that out.

We're going to compact that to make sure we have good compression.

♪♪ ♪♪ Emmanuel, if you want to grab the hose... -Emmanuel: Yeah.

-Mark: ...we'll wet the whole thing down and then we'll do that again.

And we should be tight.

Adding water helps particles stick together to create a more stable base.

♪♪ All right, so, Shannon, you did a great job with the compactor.

-Shannon: Thank you.

-Mark: You got a rough grade with the gravel, which is very important, but, as well, the sand is very important.

But we're going to have to spend a little time establishing that grade because that's going to be our final grade.

So what we've done is I've taken some string and I've run it from front to back, and that's -- I'm going to establish my pitch with that first.

But I'm going to add a paver.

This is going to be -- You can call it a dummy paver, but that's where we're going to get our lines from.

And then, I put some sand down to act as our final grade.

But you can see this metal post that I have right here?

Emmanuel: Mm-hmm.

Mark: We are actually going to set that to the proper height.

And then, we're going to take the metal screed that's right behind me, and then we're going to screed.

We have another rail behind us.

We're going to screed from rail to rail all the way from front to back.

And that's going to give us our height.

And after that, we're just going to be able to throw pavers in.

So let's get some sand.

Perfect.

Excellent.

Thank you.

Great, Shannon.

All right, guys, why don't you guys grab the compactor?

We'll bring the compactor back in, and then we'll end up fluffing it back up and running the screed.

-Emmanuel: Okay.

-Mark: All right.

All right, so, Emmanuel, all you and I are going to do is drag this screed, flip it up to this side.

And you can even chop a little bit like that.

All right.

And then, Shannon, if you see a divot or a low spot, just take some sand and throw it in.

♪♪ All right, guys, one last thing I want to do is square this patio up.

We always use what we call the 3, 4, 5 method, which is take this tape.

-Emmanuel: Mm-hmm.

Mark: Emmanuel, please find me 4 feet down there.

Emmanuel: Okay.

4 feet.

Mark: Right there.

And I've already pre-marked that.

So you can see that mark right there.

-Emmanuel: okay.

-Mark: All right Shannon, take the tape.

-Shannon: okay.

Mark: And give me 3 feet.

There should be a mark there, as well.

Shannon: There is it.

Mark: So, Emmanuel, if you take the tape and go back down to that mark, it should be 5 feet right here.

-Emmanuel: Oh, over, okay.

-Mark: Yeah.

Perfect.

So now we know we have a 90-degree angle.

That way we're going to be able to take our patio pavers and fly that way, fly this way, and then fill in.

-Emmanuel: Okay.

-Mark: All right.

-Shannon: Great.

-Mark: So let's get going.

Shannon: Let's do it.

Mark: We took our reference photo earlier and stacked our pavers by size to make re-laying them easier.

It's like a puzzle.

All right.

So, Shannon, all we're doing is throwing the sand around.

Shannon: Yeah.

Mark: It's going to fall in the cracks.

Shannon: So, Mark, why sand?

Mark: We do have to fill in these gaps.

But as we've discussed today, all of our work is in the prep.

So if we do our prep work properly, we're not going to have a lot of movement.

-Shannon: Yeah.

-Mark: And for that reason, I like the old-school sand and then really locks everything together.

Shannon: Hey, look what I found.

Mark: Look at that.

All right.

Nice touch.

-Emmanuel: Yes.

Yes.

-Mark: Nice touch.

Shannon: There we go.

Mark: All right.

So, what do you guys think?

Shannon: This is awesome.

This is great.

-Mark: All right.

-Emmanuel: Yeah.

Yeah.

Shannon: This is great.

Emmanuel: Same ingredients, different chef.

-Mark: Well... -Emmanuel: and we appreciate it.

Mark: I had great help, so thank you.

Sous chef, I guess.

-Shannon: Thank you.

-Emmanuel: Yeah, I'll take it.

This is beautiful.

Well, we really appreciate it.

-Mark: You got it.

-Shannon: Thank you.

Mark: All right, Emanuel, thank you for having me.

Shannon, thank you very much.

-Shannon: Thank you, Mark.

We'll see you guys soon.

-Emmanuel: See you next time.

-Shannon: Nice.

Good job.

-Emmanuel: Yeah.

We did it.

I think the table goes over here.

Shannon: Okay.

Emmanuel: And then, maybe like... Shannon: The umbrella?

♪♪ -Kevin: Hey, Nathan.

-Nathan: Hey, Kevin.

Kevin: Looks like you robbed the ladder store.

Nathan: I brought every one I own.

Kevin: That's a lot of ladders.

And then some.

Nathan: So you'll see a variety.

We have, you know, fiberglass and aluminum, but you won't see a wood one over there.

Kevin: So what's the deal?

We're just done with wood ladders?

Nathan: I think so, yeah.

They stopped making them a few years ago.

If you still have them and they're serviceable, you can keep using them.

But nowadays mostly fiberglass and aluminum.

Kevin: So walk me through why you would choose one over the other.

What situation?

Nathan: Starting with fiberglass, it doesn't conduct electricity, which is why you see a lot of electricians use it.

I like to use it because I do a lot of siding jobs.

If there's a line coming into the side of the house, it's a little bit safer carrying it around.

-Kevin: Abundance of caution.

-Nathan: Yeah, but -- Kevin: The aluminum, obviously, super light.

Nathan: Light, that's the best thing about it.

If you're working around a house like a painter, loves the aluminum ladders because they're light, easy to move around.

But for me, I mostly have fiberglass.

Kevin: Okay.

So lots of different styles, as we can see here behind us.

Why don't you walk us through some of them?

Nathan: A couple of my A frames or step ladders.

This is a 10-footer that I have.

It doesn't come out too often, but... Kevin: I'm looking fiberglass, obviously the color, but two materials.

Nathan: Fiberglass.

But we do -- We do have that aluminum step on this one.

Kevin: Right.

This is the go-to, the 6-footer, A-frame.

Use that all the time.

Nathan: Yep.

I keep one in my truck.

Great on the job.

So you can see it's stiffened up here on the step, but you don't really see that over here.

This is a little bit.

Kevin: And, so, anyone can pick the right one because they got a label on it when you're shopping for it.

And generally those things stay on.

So they remind you.

-Nathan: Right on the side here.

You know, if you're going down the aisle, you can look.

If you're a homeowner, you say, well, I don't really don't need a 300-pound ladder, rated for 300 pounds.

225 pounds on this one.

This one's a type two so a little bit lighter duty.

Still a great ladder, -Kevin: But also fiberglass.

Okay.

These things, I mean, these are all the rage, and sometimes they are worth their weight in gold.

Nathan: Absolutely.

Keep this one in my truck at all times.

-Kevin: Yeah.

-Nathan: Multi-position ladder.

You know, a lot of people have them now, especially homeowners, because they can do so many things.

I can open this up, stand it against the side of a building.

Kevin: So it ends up looking like this right here.

Nathan: Yep.

Or I can pull my pins on the side.

I can raise it.

So if I would need to get on stairs, I can do that.

Kevin: That is essential when you've got to have a shorter one up the stairs and a long one down the stairs, chandelier or something like that.

Nathan: Very handy to have.

Kevin: So, A-frame's basically articulating, and then we've got the traditional extension ladder.

Nathan: Jumping over to extension ladders, I have this one all set up here.

This one is a 24-footer.

I use this a lot when I'm doing siding.

It's got a good amount of reach to it.

Not too heavy, you know.

I can set this one up easily and move it around by myself.

This one here, I have the stabilizer on it.

You can see it's great working around windows or if we're cleaning the gutters, it really helps make that ladder feel really safe as you walk up.

Kevin: And if you were going to paint those sash and you didn't have the stabilizers, you'd basically be on the left reaching over and maybe have to flip and go to the right and reach over, as well.

Nathan: You don't want to reach out when you're on extension ladders or any ladder.

Kevin: No, you don't.

Okay.

And we got this guy.

Nathan: But this one here has a cool built-in feature.

You can see if I'm -- if the grade's off a little bit, I can ratchet that down.

Kevin: So sort of a built-in leveler.

Nathan: Built in leveler.

And what's great is it's on both sides.

So if you're working around the house and the grade tapers away, you can make it safe.

Kevin: Okay.

So another fiberglass, same height.

This one is probably a little taller.

Nathan: This one's got -- This one's taller.

This one's a 28.

Better reach on this one.

But this one's kind of new and fancy.

This has a built-in cable assist on it, so it actually makes it 50% lighter as I raise and lower it.

Kevin: Built-in cable assist.

So we're not raising and lowing just with the rope?

Nathan: You use the rope, still use the rope.

But as I lean this out, like, one hand, I can pull this up and down.

As opposed to that ladder, I'm lifting the whole weight.

Kevin: So you've got a cable that's giving you assistance to pick this up.

So same weight, but it's just helping to bring it up and down.

Nathan: See the cable right there?

Kevin: Yeah.

Nathan: Helps take some of the load off.

And then, if I bring this all the way down...

It's almost like it's spring-loaded.

So we want to be safe when we travel, too.

We got a strap here.

We can lock it out.

And it also has a built-in lock on the side here.

So as I bring it up, I need to take this flipper, bring it out.

-Kevin: You got it right here.

-Nathan: Yeah.

Kevin: Otherwise we get stuck up on that.

-Nathan: Yeah.

-Kevin: Very nice.

So if that was strapped to the roof of your truck, you wouldn't want this thing flying its way out.

Nathan: No, I wouldn't want it to extend out.

Kevin: So it's interesting, as we raise and lower that it changed the angle that this ladder was at.

Nathan: Yes.

It does.

Kevin: I think that's something that people often get wrong.

Nathan: One of the most important parts is to have it the right distance away from the house.

The easiest way to do it -- stand at the base and put your palms out.

If your palms land comfortably on the rungs, that means you have the ladder set up right.

Another thing you can do is also sight.

Most of these rungs have flat spots on them, so you can kind of sight that in relation with the grade.

-Kevin: Yeah.

-Nathan: And then realize if it's too close or too far.

-Kevin: Right.

You got a couple options for the feet right here.

You've got these laid flat.

But as we know, those will also spike into place.

Nathan: We can we could spin these out.

Step on it, drive it into the ground.

And now it's going to keep it from pushing out.

Kevin: Built-in accessories.

Cable assist, I love that.

But other accessories that you can add.

Nathan: First one, ladder jack.

So any remodeler will have a set of these.

It's a great way to make a fast, level surface to work on.

Kevin: So using the existing rungs, this is spaced accordingly.

Nathan: That slides right over the rung.

And then we loosen this wing nut, we adjust the pitch of it.

We want to make it level.

-Kevin: A little bit, right.

-Nathan: Yeah.

So once we have this level, you envision we have another one over here we can put a plank on.

We don't want to go too high with those though.

It's good for doing windows down low.

Kevin: Right.

Something stable to sit on, a little easier to work on.

-Nathan: Yep.

-Kevin: And... -Nathan: Set of bumpers.

Those are great to have.

Throw them on the top of your extension ladder.

Protect the house.

Kevin: Yeah.

Protect the work.

Very nice.

Two of those.

Nathan: And we have a leveler.

Kevin: These are levelers that you can buy separately and then put them on an existing... Nathan: Yeah.

So you can modify a ladder.

Slides up and down, locks out.

And what's great, it still has the foot at the end.

Kevin: Yeah.

Yeah.

Very nice.

-Nathan: Change that.

-Kevin: And the last one.

Nathan: This one's a little bit of a Swiss Army tool.

You can set this up.

If the grades tapering away, you can put this down.

You can put one foot on this, you can flip it over.

So you envision if the grade was really dropping, you could create a level surface to work on.

Kevin: Yes.

It's got a little grip surface right there.

Nathan: Yeah.

You can also use this one as a ladder jack, as well.

Create a small surface to put a plank on.

Kevin: So... Oh, yeah.

Very clever.

Right there.

Nathan: You can't adjust the pitch on that one.

Kevin: No, but if you're in the right position, that could actually be a big help.

-Nathan: Yeah.

-Kevin: All right.

Well, I like it.

A lot of ladders right here.

You're gonna get them back to the store?

Nathan: Yeah.

[ Chuckles ] ♪♪ -Heath: Hi, Nadia.

-Nadia: Hi.

Heath: I'm Heath.

Nice to meet you.

Nadia: Nice to meet you.

Heath: So I saw that you wrote in about an EV charger.

You want to tell me a little bit about what you have going on?

Nadia: Sure.

So I have a plug-in hybrid.

-Heath: Okay.

-Nadia: And I have amazing charging capability when I get to work.

But at home, not so much.

-Heath: Happens a lot.

So everyone can charge them easily at work, but at home, it's a little more difficult.

So I'm guessing, at work, you probably have a level two, but at home, maybe using that one that comes with it, the one that plugs into a regular receptacle.

-Nadia: Exactly.

-Heath: Yeah.

And you only get 2 or 3, maybe 5 miles to the hour of a charge on that?

-Nadia: Yes.

-Heath: All right.

So we probably want to put a level two in here.

Make that a little easier on you.

-Nadia: That'd be great.

-Heath: All right.

So let's take a look at the garage, see how you use it.

And we'll see what we have for options.

Nadia: Okay.

Heath: All right, Nadia.

So this looks like the level one charger that came with the car that you use to charge now.

Nadia: Exactly.

Heath: When you pull the car in and you go to charge, where do you have to pull that cord to?

Is it that side or this side?

-Nadia: It's on that side.

Heath: It's on this side.

Okay.

So we have to drag that cord around, in the way the stairs, plug on this side.

I mean, the good news is a lot of chargers come with a 25-foot cord, so you have some flexibility, but that's a little inconvenient and a little in the way.

I would tend to think maybe if we put the charger somewhere over here?

Nadia: I think that's a good spot.

Heath: All right, let's go to the basement, take a look at the power, and see how we get over here.

Nadia: Okay.

Heath: So how long have you lived here, Nadia?

Nadia: I've lived here for 10 years.

Heath: And did you get it new?

It looks like it's about that age.

Nadia: Yeah, it was built in 2013.

Heath: Perfect.

It'll help us with a little bit of an idea of what's in the walls and how things go.

So it looks like, from the size of the cable, we probably have either 100 or 125 amp service coming in.

And with no main breaker, our breaker's outside somewhere.

And it looks like we're pretty full, but we see a tandem in here.

And a lot of times with these panels, even though we have a certain number of spaces, it may take more circuits than it actually shows.

So what I want to do is I want to go outside and turn the main breaker off, lock this out so I can take this cover off safely, and see if we can actually add more to this without having to add a subpanel in order to put this charger in for you.

Okay?

-Nadia: Okay, great.

-Heath: All right.

I'll be right back.

When I'm doing electrical work on a box with a shutoff that's remotely mounted, I want to be sure that I am the only person that can turn this main breaker on and off.

This device secures the breaker in the off position, and I can add a lock to further insure against the device being turned back on.

A safety tag will alert anyone that work is being done in the house, and not to tamper with the main.

All right, that breaker's off and it looks like everything's off in the house, but we just want to double check and make sure it really is.

Nadia: What are we looking for?

Heath: So the first thing we're going to check is we're going to use a no-contact tester just to check that feed and make sure that's off.

I know we have a label outside on the breaker that says it is, but sometimes things are mislabeled.

So that says it's off.

So we're going to go ahead and take this cover off.

All right.

Nadia: Oh, wow.

Heath: Yeah, you probably don't get to see the inside of that too often.

So while that noncontact tester is pretty good, they're not foolproof.

So I just want to check it with a meter to verify that.

Great.

So it's labeled correctly and the power's really off.

Let me just set that aside.

So now I want to look for a manufacturer's tag that's hopefully in the panel, since we didn't have something that was specific on the cover for what we could do.

All right.

And there's our manufacturer tag.

And that's just what we want to see.

3040, so it's telling us that there are 30 spaces available and 40 circuits.

So that means it's acceptable to install a certain number of these tandems, which is great news.

So we can move a few of these around, make room for that new breaker, and install the charger without having to install an additional subpanel over there.

-Nadia: Great.

-Heath: So, before we do that, I'd just like to take you upstairs.

We'll take a look at the stuff that's going in, and then we'll get to work.

-Nadia: All right.

♪♪ Heath: All right, Nadia.

So this might look a little familiar, maybe similar to the charger you have at work.

Nadia: Yeah.

It's similar.

Heath: So this is a level two charger, and the advantage is you can install a level two charger without having to upgrade the entire service just to accommodate it.

And what it does is it takes this little module that goes into the electric panel, monitors how much power is actually being used by the house, and if it finds the level's too high, it'll turn this charger back off.

When it sees the level go down, it'll turn the charger back on.

That way you don't have to upgrade the entire service just to have the level two.

-Nadia: Love that.

Heath: Then what we're going to do is install the receptacle.

So to get the actual power, I'm going to take that receptacle, install this box with a cable, put that in, and then we can plug this right in.

Nadia: So, in the future, if I want to get a different charger, can I change it out myself?

Heath: Exactly.

That's the advantage of having this receptacle.

So you can simply unplug the charger, unmount it, mount the new one, plug the new one in, and you're good to go.

I mean, you know, technology changes all the time, so I'm sure we're gonna have something new in a few years.

Nadia: Yeah, I love that.

Heath: So I think we have all of our parts.

We have some wire here, we've got everything ready to go.

I think we just get started.

You ready?

-Nadia: All right, let's do it.

-Heath: Let's get to work.

So I'm going to give you the tape measure and I'm going to give you this.

So what we want to try and do is find a stud in this wall now that we know this is where we want the charger.

And I want the stud because it's gonna be a much more rigid mount for holding this in place.

I don't have to worry about it falling out with a wall anchor.

So what you do is, it's just a magnet.

So you want to wave that around the wall and just kind of drag it until we find it stick.

Then we'll know there's a screw that's holding the drywall up.

Right there?

Perfect.

Actually, that's a pretty good spot.

So I'm thinking we'll put the charger right on that, somewhere maybe around 4 feet.

The cord is going to wrap around the hook down here.

And that gives us a spot to put the receptacle right there to plug it in.

What do you think?

-Nadia: looks good to me.

Heath: I think it's out of the way of the door pretty comfortable.

All right.

So what I want to do next is, now that you have the tape measure, I'm going to have you pass it to me, and I'm going to go to the wall in the corner.

I'm going to take a measurement to the center of this.

Then we'll go to the basement and find this location.

I want to go down there and drill up to make sure we can get into this wall before we cut a hole in the garage and make a mess that we have to patch.

-Nadia: Okay.

-Heath: So I'll take that, and let's see how far off that wall we are.

What do you have to the middle?

Nadia: 108.

Heath: All right, let's head to the basement.

We'll go find it.

All right.

Nadia, if you want to take that and just hook it on the edge of the concrete, I'm going to come over here.

So our original number was 108?

-Nadia: 108.

-Heath: 108.

Okay.

And I'm adding for the thickness of the wall.

So that puts us somewhere right around here.

Great.

So it looks like it's unobstructed and we should be able to get up there.

So what I'm going to do next is go ahead and drill that hole, make sure we can do that, run the wire.

And then I'll come and get you in a little bit and we're all set.

-Nadia: Okay, great.

♪♪ ♪♪ ♪♪ Heath: Pull it down.

♪♪ I chose to use MC cable on this project because I like the physical protection aspect of it.

I feel much better with this being fished up a wall, especially attached to a garage.

♪♪ ♪♪ Finally, I'm going to install the main current transformers and connect them to the device that's going to measure the electrical usage while the charger is in use.

Now I can turn the power back on.

♪♪ Hey, Nadia, you're just in time.

So, the level two car charger is complete.

We put the receptacle in, it's tied into the panel.

It's ready to go and use as is.

And we also installed the energy monitor that came with that kit, as well.

Nadia: Awesome.

Anything else I need to do?

Heath: The only other thing you want to do is you want to download the app that goes with this system.

That'll just give you a little more control and flexibility over everything that it can do.

But other than that, you're good to go.

You can charge at home.

You have to wait at work anymore.

Nadia: Awesome.

Looks great.

Thank you.

Heath: You're welcome.

Enjoy.

♪♪ Kevin: Next time on "Ask This Old House"... Nathan helps a homeowner replace their broken trash insert.

And have you noticed some types of light bulbs disappearing from store shelves?

Heath educates us on why this is happening.

Plus, Lee removes some arborvitaes that have become an overgrown eyesore.

All that on "Ask This Old House."